I was first introduced to the concept of “fully formed adult” by a colleague from a different company more than a decade ago. He told me that they only hire fully formed adults. Not simply adults, but “fully formed adults”. I felt an immediate affinity to that term, and asked him to explain what they meant by it. He gave me a bunch of examples, and the common theme I heard was that a child needs to be monitored and a “fully formed adult” can be trusted to do the right thing unsupervised.
One of the examples he gave me at the time was that they didn’t track vacation days. An adult can be trusted to get his/her work done and not abuse vacation days even if they’re not monitored. I loved the concept, though I felt it’s a little bit of a double edged sword: is it more likely that in a highly competitive environment people will feel pressure to work more rather than take any vacation in that situation? Maybe it’s a sign I’ve never worked in an environment exclusively populated by fully formed adults? Maybe I’m not one myself?
My colleague never defined “fully formed adult”; it was more of an expectation that when you see one, you’ll know it. But I’ve often wondered if I could define it, so here’s my stab at what characterizes a fully formed adult:
CRITICAL THINKING: often defined as the ability to analyze “available facts, evidence, observations, and arguments to form a judgment.” To me, it’s a must-have requirement of a “fully formed adult”, and I often refer to it as the ability to think for oneself, to think independently. No, it’s not a characteristic that is universally respected. Maybe that’s why the quote to the right, attributed to Henry Ford struck me so much.
BASIC KNOWLEDGE: critical thinking requires the ability to analyze facts and observations. That makes having some basic facts absolutely essential. I’ve often heard the argument that “I can just look up whatever I need.” But to know what one needs to look up, one needs to have a basis of knowledge. If someone tells you that royalty has “blue blood” and that differentiates them from the “rest” do you believe it or look it up? (Bit of trivia for today: human blood is red. In the 19th century, when royalty didn’t have to work outdoors, their skin remained pale. So royalty’s veins, unlike those of the workers, showed blue through pale skin. But that’s just because of the way the way light is reflected by our tissue. More interesting trivia is that not all animals have red blood, but this trivia detour is getting long, so no more on that.)
CURIOSITY: another underrated characteristic that I believe is essential to any full formed adult. It’s surprising how commonplace curiosity is in younger children, and how quickly it seems to evaporate even in many (not all!) young adults. Sadly, there are even sayings like “curiosity killed the cat” that caution us of it! But the burning desire to learn, to grow, fortunately remains alive and sometimes even reignites in many of us into adulthood and throughout our lives.
EMPATHY: this is a case of saving the best, or most important in this case, for last. Of all the characteristics that make a fully formed adult, I believe that empathy is the most important. We, humans, are social creatures and without empathy I’m not sure we can succeed. It is essential to who fully formed adults are.
What do you think? What characteristics define a fully formed adult? Do many of the folks you know fall under the category of “fully formed adults”?
The Endless Weekend 
Must have basic knowledge of things like sewing a button, stopping a running toilet (I don’t mean necessarily fixing it but knowing to open the back and realign) cook at least five meals, change a tire, and fix the modem
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To clarify: do you think that these are the skills that define a fully formed adult, replacing the ones I suggested (which is perfectly fine, I’ve been wrong before, this won’t be the first time 🙂 )? Or maybe you’re saying self-reliance is another characteristic that needs to be added to list?
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Totally added to the list!
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Interesting post. Honesty, Integrity, Loyalty, Charity, Dedication. Kinda sounds like a dog, doesn’t it? But, if you do not have any or all of these traits, how can you be in a work or other relationship.
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I like that, Allan! Perhaps it does sound like a dog, but you know what Mark Twain said about dogs? “If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and man.”
So let me ask you thinks: do you think to be fully formed humans the characteristics we need are honesty, integrity, loyalty, charity, and dedication ON TOP of the ones I listed? Instead of?
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On TOP of. Empathy is the bedrock though.
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Empathy is indeed the bedrock
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What a terrific observation! If you had to rank them, empathy would be the one you’d rank at the top? I’d really like to know what your thoughts are: I’m not sure how to rank them. I think empathy is a necessary characteristic both in individuals as well in any society. But isn’t that true of critical thinking? How about curiosity?
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I am indeed dealing with mixed thoughts regarding this…but I will stand by my initial thought.
Empathy is the bedrock.
In a world where everyone is becoming more selfish daily, it is a breath of fresh air to experience and also show empathy.
When we understand and share people’s feelings, it is one step closer to solving even the biggest/impossible problems.
My opinion.
Critical thinking, curiosity and the rest are important…but not as important as empathy, in a world where we are created to live with other humans.
🙂🙂🙂🙂
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Lovely post EW! I can’t agree with you more about empathy. It’s so important and seems lacking in so many different areas. I suspect it’s missing because folks are still trying to recover in many respects from work and home challenges. When you don’t have empathy though, you miss out on the pain and struggles of others. You’re in your own little world and never let others in. I believe though when we see life in others, we get empathy in return! Love the idea of fully formed adults. Thanks for sharing!😎
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Thank YOU, Brian! That’s an intriguing point: when were we at our best in terms of empathy? When did we value empathy the most? YES, you’re right , being self-focused certainly makes it more difficult to be empathetic!
Tbh, I wasn’t sure if most would agree with empathy, especially being the most important, as a characteristic of a fully formed adult! I’m glad to have found a kindred soul!
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So good, EW! You know me…empathy for the win every day…but I appreciate your awesome list of characteristics — and agree with each. I could always use more in the ‘critical thinking’ department and basic knowledge. I think it’s why I enjoy your posts so much – I’m always learning from you. The only “other” nugget that popped to mind (but it might just be recent experiences or related to the work I do) is the thought that demonstrating empathy is closely associated with that beautiful, often overlooked skill of listening. Mouth closed, ears and heart open. I can’t be a very good human when I’m in a rush, too impatient to listen and learn before I respond.
xo to you for this lovely post! 😘
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Thank YOU, Vicki, for your wonderful words and compliments! I’m glad we agreed empathy: especially in a workplace, it sometimes seems underrated. Maybe not only in a workplace, come to think of it? Do you think that it’s true that it’s underrated? And I can’t help wonder why?
And, YES, listening, especially the active listening that you’ve described is absolutely essential: how can we hope to understand if we don’t listen, and like you said, ears, eyes, and heart open. I don’t see how we can have empathy, understanding of another without listening, like you said. Maybe that’s why the old saying goes that we have 2 eyes, 2 ears, but only one mouth for a reason 😁
The only thing I disagree with is that you’re ever NOT a good human being, whether in a rush or otherwise 🥰
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I love that you mentioned that finer point — active listening. Yes, yes! Such a great post, EW — thanks for all of it…great food for thought, as always. 🥰
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Thank you for pointing out this facet of empathy. I think it requires its own post—beware of the seeds you sow in my mind ❤ Or, in other words, THANK YOU (caps intentional).
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HUGS! (Caps intentional!)
🥰🥰🥰
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❤ ❤ ❤
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I think this makes me a fully formed adult EW! I believe I have achieved and consistently use all the criteria you highlight so I will take the win- although I have no need to be employed again! I do like Vicki’s addition of listening ability because that seems to enhance the others and sometimes I do have to restrain myself and sit quietly to let others finish their thoughts before I begin processing their words and asking questions. I wonder though if the assumption from an employer is different is some focused business viewpoint rather than simply a human standpoint? Then there are those who may say that if they can get up in the morning and get to work on time their standards are being met. Personal perspective must play a part in this topic I suspect.
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Believe it or not, I knew as I was writing that YOU’d fit the category 🥰
I did first encounter this “fully formed adult” category in a work setting, but wouldn’t life in general be better if we had more fully formed adults?
And YES! Active listening is essential: do you think it’s a prerequisite for empathy? Can one be empathetic, truly understand another, without active listening?
I hear you about the standards some workplaces set: from what I read, Henry Ford did not yearn for fully formed adults in his workplace. He wanted hands, not brains. But I believe that any workplace, any place, would be better if it was entirely populated by fully formed adults. They’d find ways of improving the workplace, no? Is it just me daydreaming or do you think that that’s true?
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Oh, that is such a genuine and nice thing to say EW! I absolutely think ffa should be required for all, not just business 😉
Empathy was something that I found challenging for a long time because the helper part of me, and the all-knowing adult part of me would break into the words of others and start giving advice- all the while missing the their point and only hearing part of their concerns or worries. I still sometimes have to chant in my own head- keep quiet, they aren’t done speaking yet- but it makes such a huge difference in my responses when I do. I’ve also learned that a response isn’t always necessary, just the being there is enough.
Learning to read the person is crucial to empathy.
My HoTM post this coming Saturday is focused on my last position. I will just say that the corporation I worked for strongly emulated Henry Fords philosophy. Many of us often “joked” that we were simply the trained primates and we knew how easily replaceable we were.
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I once read an article written by a lady who went through her 20s in one start-up after another. She had a blast working in each one of them, but each one of them failed. She was now in her 30s, working in an enterprise and she shared that if in each of those start-ups they had a wise and experienced person who would stop them and point out the glaring error they were committing, most of those start-ups would have been able to correct the error and thrive. But there were only the inexperienced folks in the start-ups, making well known mistakes and falling flat on their faces.
Why am I sharing this? Because sometimes I do think it’s important to share difficult-to-hear-and-absorb advice. I know how hard it is (still :)) for me. I know that learning the hard way tends to be more memorable, but so much more painful… If only we could listen to those sage pieces of advice and embrace them? Yes, from someone empathetic, maybe not exactly like the cat in this video:
🙂
I’m looking forward reading your post!
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I have been that mother cat 😉
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I don’t think anybody can claim to be a fully formed adult. There’s always some new wisdom to be gained, right?
I’ve applied for a job or two with unlimited vacation time, but sadly, never got hired. I think it’s a great perk that some people will abuse and others will under-utilize, so in the end, it all balances out for the employer – and makes the employee happy. Win/win.
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What a terrific insight: yes, when we stop growing, changing, learning something new, we fade away? Maybe that’s a key characteristic of what it means to be fully formed: a continuously evolving form?
I once read of a company (no, I didn’t work there) that as terms of employment required folks to take a minimum of 2 continuous weeks of vacation a year! Yes, they gave employees more than that. Their thought process was that many employees don’t take the time to recharge, which is badly needed, and often take one odd day here and there for errands, which is not helpful in recharging. I loved that idea!
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I wish more companies adopted this mindset. Work/life balance truly is important, and just feeling appreciated by your employer is so refreshing. This is a great way to attract and keep top-level talent.
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So … How do I nominate you to be a CEO? 🙂
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Great post! BTW, horseshoe crabs have blue blood.
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Thank you so much, Mike and Kellye! I love recognizing a kindred trivia lover!
I didn’t know that about horseshoe crabs, thank you very much for sharing—I once read the snail blood dries up blue, though I don’t know for sure if that’s true (but it rhymed, so it must be 😁)
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A great post and follow-up discussion, EW. You prompted me to consider whether anyone of us is capable of identifying a fully formed adult. The benchmark for a fully formed adult is set very high: an individual who has reached physical, emotional, and mental maturity. Physically, they have completed their growth and development, and are able to take care of themselves. Emotionally, they are able to regulate their emotions, communicate effectively, and form healthy relationships. Mentally, they have developed critical thinking skills, problem-solving abilities, and have a clear sense of their values and beliefs.
I believe that we are a work in progress, that we moving ever forward, that we meet others who are on the journey of seeking the best for themselves and for others.
I like Jospeh Campbell’s take on this idea: “We’re not on our journey to save the world but to save ourselves. But in doing that you save the world. The influence of a vital person vitalizes.”
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Thank you so much, Rebecca, both for your kind and generous words and for your insightful comments!
Can you give me an example of someone you feel is a “fully formed adult”? I’d be really interested in an example that can “ground” your description in my mind.
Your words on journey remind me of Cavafy’s spectacular poem, Ithaka, which starts with
“As you set out for Ithaka
hope your road is a long one,
full of adventure, full of discovery.”
And ends with
“And if you find her poor, Ithaka won’t have fooled you.
Wise as you will have become, so full of experience,
you’ll have understood by then what these Ithakas mean.”
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Go back about ten years and see the difference between then and now. I guess a fully formed adult is one who knows basics, how to change a tire, cook, fix a toilet or a faucet, but more, now he has to adapt to new things and attitudes, new norms and expectations.
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I like the question you’re posing, but I’m not sure I fully understand it: what’s the difference you see between ten years ago and now?
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Well, the ability to try and the will to do thing on your own. Not to join a crowd and be a follower but go on your own without reliance on strangers. Think for yourself. The difference in people ten years ago and now is striking. People don’t want to talk, to compromise or discuss. It’s like I am right, that’s it. If you disagree you are a racist, misogynist, or a fool. We have lost a lot.
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I hear two different and both intriguing points:
1) Tell me if I understood you correctly, I think the first point is both Albert Einstein’s “Problems cannot be solved with the same mind set that created them”, and Mark Twain’s “Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.”?
2) I think your second point might be a lamentation of how we lost some of the empathy that we used to have? A couple of people pointed out that “listening” is a necessary precursor to empathy, what do you think?
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Empathy is becoming a lost art. On the first point you hit it perfectly.
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Sounds rather subjective to me. But I worry that a potential employer taking the phrase, “fully formed adult” too literally might request applicants to strip.
I definitely agree that empathy would be the most important element. But this can be pretty hard to judge with one 10-minute interview. Perhaps that employer should have a lengthy probationary period for all new hires.
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😀 Gotta say, that aspect of “fully formed adult” did not occur to me 😀 😀 😀
I agree with you, the interview process can and should be expanded! There was a company, Zappos that used to at their earlier days (not sure what they do now) have their new employees go through a week or two of “orientation.” At the end of that period, they offered each person $2,000 to LEAVE. I kid you not. To say something like “well, I didn’t know that this is what you guys were all about, not a great fit for me, thank you for the $2k nudge, I’ll take it for this time I spent with you and LEAVE.” It’s almost exactly the opposite of the concept of “golden handcuffs” that try to convince new employees to stay. An incentive to … LEAVE! What do you think about that?
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They must have had a lot of confidence in their company to make that kind of offer to new employees. I’ll bet it was fun working there.
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From all indications (meaning, from what I read…), it was a FANTABULOUS place to work 🙂 Their CEO/founder said “We want to make sure that employees aren’t here just for paychecks and truly believe this is the right place for them,” Can you imagine working only with people who truly want to be there?
I once read that one of their customer support folks spent 10 hours on a support call… Apparently the colleague of this person brought them food during the long support call. Can you imagine?!
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I only hope they’re a profitable company. I like businesses like that.
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It was purchased by Amazon more than 10 years ago for over $1b (billion!), so I’d say yes, they were very successful in that strategy. There are so many wonderful things they did, and you just convinced me to read his book: thank you very much! I was waiting for that nudge for a while now.
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I’m not sure I agree with your colleague’s definition of a fully formed adult. It appears that they want a fully formed robot. Your idea is far better.
I don’t believe in the concept of a fully formed adult. I believe we are here to become fully formed humans, not adults, and that there are children among us who can teach us all how to be better humans.
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I bet you liked the Simone de Beauvoir quote (if you spotted it), just like I did. It’s the first quote I used and it says “what is an adult? A child blown up by age.”
It’s funny you should say “fully formed human”: I had to proof read the post several times and each time I found that I used “fully formed human” in yet another place, rather than “fully formed adult” 🙂
I’m honored that you like my characteristics, help me understand what you disliked about my colleague’s company’s definition of “fully formed adults”? Knowing that will probably help me hone in my thought process, so I would greatly appreciate it!
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That particular quote struck a chord with me. I also like how you use quotes in your posts.
I think what I disliked the most was when they used words like “trusted,” “unsupervised,” and “monitored.”
Time off should not be used as a form of punishment by those in positions of authority.
I just didn’t think that one situation described by the colleague was a good indicator of a “fully formed adult.”
I hope this makes sense.
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Thank you, I do love quotes (and images)!
Help me understand a little better, please give me an example that would feel like a good indicator or a fully formed human?
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Maybe I don’t believe that there is such a thing as a “fully formed adult.” But I believe in multiple lifetimes, so maybe that helps you understand me a little better. I believe that life is a journey and that we are here to learn. I also believe it is not up to us to define what it means to be a “fully formed adult.”
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Yes to life being a journey and not a destination, like in Cavafy’s spectacular poem, Ithaka, which starts with “As you set out for Ithaka hope your road is a long one, full of adventure, full of discovery.” And ends with “And if you find her poor, Ithaka won’t have fooled you. Wise as you will have become, so full of experience,
you’ll have understood by then what these Ithakas mean.”
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I love this post! Such a fascinating topic, well-written and related within a context with FANTASTIC quotes – signature EW!! And I love that your trivia about blue bloods (I didn’t know that was what was behind the term) rolled right in to the Curiosity element because it just fit so well.
I’d add integrity. I’m thinking of the definition from Rabbi Jonathan Omer-Man “Integrity is the ability to listen to a place inside oneself that doesn’t change, even though the life that carries it may change.”
Thanks for getting me thinking – as always. I love thinking about what it takes to make a fully-formed adult — and what it takes to raise a fully-formed adult. And in the latter category, I’d say preservation of some childlike things is necessary — like curiosity!
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First thing, THANK YOU Wynne for your generous and uplifting words. I feel 2” taller after reading your comment. THANK YOU!
Second thing, though not less important, THANK YOU for the splendid addition. Yes! Integrity! Great (and new to me, so third thanks 🥰) quote! It brings to mind the words of Abraham Lincoln “Important principles may, and must, be inflexible.” We have to know which ones are those (few) important principles and stick by them, especially through thin, since it’s easy to stick to them through thick, good times. Most excellent addition, THANK YOU!
And, yes, to curiosity and the desire to discover new stuff. Idk if that was Umberto Eco’s desire, but one of the things from The Name of the Rose that stick most with me was that pronouncement by one of the characters that their role was ONLY to preserve existing knowledge, never to discover anything new. Talk about stifling any curiosity…
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Oh, I love your response, EW! That’s a fascinating character description – and a role (in life) that I’d never want to play. Thank goodness for people like you who are always delving deeper into life and thinking!! XOXO
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Anyone who could write this post and wade through 40 comments on this topic is a fully formed adult!
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🤣🤣🤣 I’ll take that as a fully-formed compliment 😁 So thank you fully much!
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Your definition of a fully formed adult rings true with me. I know many adults who can hit all the variables, but not consistently. It’s the ones who can do all four of the variables all [most?] of the time that seem fully formed to me.
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Thank you, Ally, on both counts, and especially on the extremely insightful observation: consistency. Yes! You are absolutely right! It’s almost impossible to be 100% consistent, sometimes you’re too tired to be curious? But if you can do it most of the time, you’re definitely ahead of the game! Love that very astute observation, thank you for bring it up!
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I would love to know how you determine from a job interview that a potential employee is a fully formed adult. I like the idea of hiring people who are only fully formed adults – it makes everything easier at work, for sure.
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I so agree with you: interviews, even panel interviews, even a series of interviews leave much to be desired. I think there’s nothing like personal recommendations and “trial runs.”
Have you heard of Zappos? They used to put their newly hired employees through a 2 week orientation. Already an awesome investment in an employee! At the end of the 2 weeks they’d offer the employees $2,000 to LEAVE. They essentially said, unless you’re uber committed to Zappos now that you’ve had a couple of weeks to learn about it, cut your losses with a $2k pay for the 2 weeks, and go your merry way. How awesome is THAT?
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An interesting approach!
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Good quotes. There so much more to Einstein than that big brain of his.
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As described, I’m not sure I know any fully formed adults and if I did, I’m not sure I would like them. Where is playfulness, joy, and passion? Where is fun, being irresponsible occasionally, and doing something just for yourself? Where is putting others needs first, before your job even sometimes? I think being a fully formed adult should not negate your human need for fun and silly.
Or perhaps that’s just the way I’m reading this.
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Playfulness, joy, and passion are wonderful characteristics and I would hope that a fully formed adult would have them or at the very least not be mutually exclusive to being a fully formed adult.
Tony Hsieh of the Zappos fame may have been one. I never knew him, so I can’t be sure, but from what I read about him he was all about Delivering Happiness. About creating a magnificent experience for his customers and a splendid place to work for his employees. He’s the one who offered new hires to Zappos $2,000 to LEAVE after they completed their two week orientation because “We want to make sure that employees aren’t here just for paychecks and truly believe this is the right place for them.”
Maybe Dr. Who from the fictional world? Full of joy and zest for life, and human in un-Time Lord fashion, in his lapses in understanding others?
I would hope that I didn’t put together a list of criteria that would imply forlorn, sad, obedient folks, but instead freethinkers, explorers, creators, discoverers!
PLEASE do tell me what in the description made you feel that fully for,Ed adults would not be a joy to be around, I must fix that immediately!
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Well, I did say that it could just be the way I was reading it. Intent isn’t always very clear in the written word.
I think the term “fully formed adult” hit me the wrong way from the get go. It feels judgmental, particularly with regard to hiring someone. And it seems to be ageist. To get all those characteristics, either implied or as listed by you, takes a lifetime in most of us. If you only hire fully formed adults, you are cutting out young, impulsive, curious people. You know, the ones who innovate and create change. The only thing that touched on the less serious side was curiousity and I certainly agree with everything you said about curiousity.
I like the way you explore ideas. They make me think and in this case, made me try to explain my reaction. Not an easy thing to do. I see that it touched certain buttons in me.
As for writing a bit again, I am home again! I have a story to tell and I hope to get to it soon.
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First things first, I’m glad you’re better, and most encouraged you’re back home!
It’s through these discussions that I can hope to hone my thinking, so I’m most appreciative that you’re helping me. THANK YOU (caps intentional)!
I get what you’re saying about the term not being the best terminology. It wasn’t even fully defined by my colleague. What I liked, what I got from it, was that it implied trust in people, in the employees that were “fully formed.” You don’t have to monitor them, you don’t need to double and triple check on them, you don’t need to create rigid processes that they must follow. You … trust that they will do the right thing since they know what it is.
I didn’t get from the term stagnation. I believe curiosity, a great desire to learn, to explore, to experience something new, to be willing to delve into new ideas, to dismiss cherished ideas if they’re clearly wrong or no longer true (based in critical thinking with basic knowledge) is absolutely necessary. Someone who wants to only preserve what is and not grow is not fully formed, imo, of course.
The more I think about it, I can see how valid your point is: the words “fully for,ed” might imply “and therefore never changing anymore.” But to me no more change is an end, it’s death.
But the term is suboptimal. What term would you suggest?
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My, what a lot of time has passed. I don’t think I was hearing stagnation in the description so much as a certain drone-ness. Employees who can be trusted to do what you want them to do are not always the best employees. They may be people who know what you want and give it to you without any creativity or innovation. Again, I’m reading it through my own filters – I’ve had that kind of boss. I think you’ve made a lot of good points but I am not creative enough to find a new term for fully formed, though I still don’t like it. 🙂
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It’s a good sign you’re posting again 🥰 How are you?
So even with curiosity and critical thinking, you still don’t like the description? Please tell me what’s missing, it was my definition to a term I heard, I want to make sure that the definition in my head holds!
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And I completely forgot to say how happy I am to hear from you again, does that mean you’re starting to feel better?
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I don’t think you are neccessarily missing anything, just because different people approach an idea from different places. My best guess is that I may not believe the employee who does what’s expected without supervision, gives the boss what the boss wants, can co-exist with the curious and creative critical thinker. I could be wrong, probably am wrong.
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Nononono! Every time you make me think it’s something I’m going to be grateful for ❤
I think it says a lot about many workplaces that so many of us may be under the assumption that a curious, creative, and critical thinking employee is unlikely to be able to work independently and do what The Boss wants. Clearly Dilbert’s popularity supports that notion. But there are other places, like the video I posted about the Ritz-Carlton (https://endlessweekend2019.wordpress.com/2022/10/05/is-awesome-customer-service-becoming-extinct/) where I believe, or maybe just hope, that this holds true…
Think it might?
What I think you’re absolutely right about is that “fully formed” does have a potential connotation of “no more progress” 😦 So I do need to think about a better term to use. Thank you for that as well.
And I hope you’re feeling better ❤ ❤ ❤
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I think I see where I am stuck. It’s not that I think someone who is creative, curious and a critical thinker is incapable of not needing supervision and doing what the boss wants, it’s whether he or she would want to do so. First we have bad bosses. I firmly believe that people who want power should by no means be allowed to have it. Remember how you noted that if the job didn’t require requesting and verifying vacation days, it would be likely that the individual would feel pressured to go beyond the job requirements and not take his or her vacation days? Is it a fully formed adult who doesn’t look after his or her own needs? Is it a job that’s worth having if you’re pressured not to take care of yourself? If you follow blindly in that pattern can you be a fully formed adult? This is what I mean about the bosses right hand person and the curious, creative, critical thinker not being compatible in the same person. And perhaps they could be with a good boss. Someone encouraging thinking and not wanting blind obedience?
And that’s where I’m stuck. Too many bad bosses in my past to see the possibility.
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I so wish I could disagree with you… But I think it’s experiencing the Peter Principle that forces me to agree with you 🙂 That people are promoted to the point they’re incompetent at doing their job, and they stay there 😀 It seems like that’s reflected in “if you’re good at job X, you will be good at managing people who do X, or Y.” And I’m not sure that there’s an understanding of what it takes to be a good manager, or a good leader.
Sort of like that demotivator poster:
https://despair.com/products/leaders
?
Maybe what we’re both saying is that critical thinkers, who are curious, know enough “stuff”, and are empathetic are the people we want to be, but that it’s more like that Henry Ford saying that most managers just want blind obedience. Even most of those who say they don’t want “yes men”, that they want to hear contrarian ideas. They don’t. They want lemmings that tell them, like the mirror on the wall, that they’re the prettiest of them all?
what do you think?
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I think we’re on the same page now. Kind of sad, don’t you think?
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I think it’s sad how much of our identity, or that of many of us, is tied to jobs that are defined by pointy-haired-managers?
I also think you’re raising a fantastic question: why are good managers under-rated? Does it fall in the same category of what great teachers are under-rated?
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I agree with your assessments. That and maturity. I’ve known some very immature 22-year-olds whom I would not consider fully-formed adults. Since our brains typically finish forming at 25, I’d consider that age a requirement to earn the distinction. 😛
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That’s a terrific point, Betsy! I once read that the the part of the brain that is responsible for understanding consequences is normally developed well after the part of the brain that understands pleasure… That certainly would explain the behavior of, well, less formed of us? 😛
Love that point, I probably should have added that, had only my thoughts been FULLY FORMED 😀
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Heh heh.
Oh man, that whole pleasure development vs consequences development seems like a serious design flaw! Very interesting, though.
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It really does! I wonder what’s the evolutionary purpose behind that…
I guess not everyone can be Chuck Norris and have death have a near-Chuck-Norris experience? 🙂
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Hahahahaha!
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Given the sources of the quotes you used, they were entirely unsurprising on that basis alone!
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That’s a very intriguing insight, help me understand what you mean better?
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They were all trailblazers.
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Whoa!!! That’s a fantastic observation about fully formed adults: I didn’t see that before you said it!
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